Help needed (pretty please)

Look here first if you are looking for a specific bike.
If you find what you're looking for, click the link.
Post Reply
SuzukiRock
Tricycles are Cool
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Oct 07, 2023 5:51 am
My Bike: Suzuki VS 750

Help needed (pretty please)

Post by SuzukiRock »

Right, I need to release this rant that's been building for the last couple of months, so if you just wanna skip to the questions feel free to scroll down, I think the hep cats call it a "TLDR" or something!

So I bought this '91 Intruder 750 on ebay, guy said it just needed "A battery, a new front tyre and some brake pads" and if that were the case the price would have been a steal in the current climate. Saw a video of it running, paid him a deposit, he dropped it off a few days later and from a quick glance over it looked fine and started, there was even a little life in the battery and he told me he'd found some brake pads for it too... so I was feeling pretty pleased. The plan was to go over everything, give it a good fettle and have it as a winter project that needed little to no work, just some tidying...

What I actually got...was a bike that had literally just been bodged together with spit, hope and wish.com universal parts, and then liberally sprayed with a flat black rattle can... I shit you not... I even found the following:

Oil filter rusted to the engine
2 different pairs of flashers, all flashing at different rates
Main beam/dipped beam wired back to front
Loose fenders front and rear, rear had made a gash in the rear tyre
Grinding noise from the fuel pump with the ignition on
brake pads sprayed on the top with black paint, caliper filthy inside no shims, no copper grease, missing one spring clip
Tank swapped for a vs1400 tank, reserve pipe glued up inside tank, single remaining outlet piped straight to pump with no fuel tap/reserve/low fuel warning.
No fuel pump relay wired in, older style 2 wire pump so didn't even have one built in.
Old tired looking foam pod air filters full of rips
Rear fender cut down to make it a bobber... rusty chrome underneath, matt black on the top, bunch of random mounting holes in the top
Seat recovered, badly, with what looked like some old brown leather sofa material
No breaking power from the rear
Head bearings shot, wheel bearings shot
Brake switches not working
Cheap chinese grips missing end caps, bars going rusty
Downpipes wrapped in black wrap to hide the extreme corrosion underneath
Thermo switch dead, rusty fake carbon effect flip switches wired to replace that and the headlight on/off switch (not present on aftermarket switchgear)
Aftermarket speedo fitted, none of the warning lights were working.
When I lifted the seat, I found a literal rats nest of electrical items, shagged wiring twisted and taped up, starter relay sitting loose in the middle of the nest like a baby bird.
Rear plate carrier rusty with black paint flaking, number plate cracked, light not working.
Clutch master cylinder was almost empty when I got it... figured it needed topping up... found out when I bought the parts to rebuild the cylinders that they were non standard and the cylinder in the clutch was completely the wrong size.... new one didnt fit, put the old one back in as it looked okay... realized that was too small as well, hence the no fluid....Ended up having to buy a new set of reservoirs because I couldn't find a cylinder assembly the right size to save my life, tried a bunch. Levers were chrome and cracked anyway...
What else... blue braided brake hose up front, only blue thing on the bike, twice as long as it needed to be and winding round the forks.
Clutch hose also braided, grey and dirty, routed incorrectly as it was too short.

*and breathe*

So... to date I've done the following:

New brake pads and shims, with all necessary clips
New brake shoes on the back
Hel braided brake and clutch lines, correct length
New generic clutch and brake fluid reservoirs/levers
New mirrors
Set of Biltwell chrome 1" Z bars that I picked up for a steal
Biltwell grips
Metal pod filters (foam to be added)
Removed the remnants of the front air box which had been butchered in half and just left
Carbs removed, cleaned and refitted
Fenders cleaned and refitted securely
New fuel petcock, taps for main and reserved fitted into side covers, one on each side
New starter relay
New indicators and flasher relay
Added diodes to the indicator lines at the bulb to prevent all 4 flashing at once
New plate carrier and rear light
Wiring fixed and repaired in multiple places
Toggle switches cleaned and refitted
New battery
New front tyre and inner tube
New wheel bearings and head race bearings (swinging was okay weirdly)

Currently in progress:
Recovering the seat with red leather, or trying, it's a little thicker than I'd like but I was just going with some leather I had lying around :bonk:
About to strip, fill, prime and paint all the tins

THE PROBLEMS (Skip to here if you're in a rush)

Fuel Pump
Alright, so everytime I think I'm close to done I run into some other weird problem, latest was fitting a replacement fuel pump and starter relay only to have it causing massive shorts at the battery. Figured it was the solenoid, replaced that AGAIN which cured the sparking, but it kept blowing fuses on the ignition line and then the pump started smoking due to some shitty wiring inside it, thanks China!
I've put the old one back on now, which is still grating inside despite cleaning the contacts, but eventually that blew a fuse too as I was about to start balancing the carbs. It's a 2 wire pump for the older models that's been put on without a relay, it's currently getting a hot wire from the killswitch O/w line but when I got the bike, it had a higher rated fuse in the ignition slot... should I:

- Wire in an aftermarket relay and correct the wiring circuit to make it standard, hoping that the grinding is just the pump trying to prime
- Try a 4 wire pump with the built in relay, which could be just as crap as the aftermarket 2 wire one that I bought
- Pay a little more for something like a Facet pump, which would probably still need a relay wiring in but would hopefully be more reliable.
- Just bang in a 30A fuse and pray nothing blows up

Side note: Can anyone with a VS750 take a photo of the wires going into the connector at the fuel pump relay please? Just so I know what goes where on a standard setup. Hopefully if I get a relay it'll have a diagram on anyway but you never know. I know it's a line from each coil, plus an orange from the fuse box which connects to a B/br wire to the pump, just curious as to where they all sit in the standard connector.

Water Temp Sensor
So, the aftermarket speedo doesn't have a water temp light. By the looks of it the original had a wire going from the sensor on the engine into the water temperature unit in the headlight, which also takes an orange hot input and presumably puts out to a black and brown line which eventually is earthed, wiring diagram isn't too clear (to me) about where else that black brown line should go. My question... do I need to connect that temp sensor to anything? I don't have a warning light for the temperature, or the water temp unit in the headlight... If it's needed could I just rig up a diode to bring the 3 wires together? Orange and B/Gr from the sensor going in and the B/Br going out?
Also... could anyone shine a light on where that black/brown line runs?
Does anyone have any input from personal experience about alternatives to the standard warning light? Any success with aftermarket lights or temperature guages I could wire in for the temperature? Especially concerned about this given that the fan has been wired in for a manual switch

Finally...

Aftermarket Speedo

So I've been left with a pretty nasty looking wish.com speedo that was doing nothing electrically. I managed to peel it open like a tin of sardines and tried to figure out what each of the wires were actually for, redid all the connections and I got indicators that worked (after adding in some diodes), but the indicator light would turn on when the high beams were switched on, no other lights seemed to work. It only has oil pressure/neutral/high beam and indicator lights, and a couple of little led's to light the dial, although I couldn't get them to work either.

Looking for any advice on units other people have fitted, or ways to figure out what's going on with the wiring on this unit. I've tried moving some connectors around and making some changes, nothing else ever lit up other than the indicators. All the budget speedo options online seem to be of a similar quality and I have a hatred of changing clocks and messing up the mileage record on bikes, so I avoid it at all costs, but if I need to I will, especially as it's already non standard.

My current plan, given that in the UK the only idiot light you need working is the indicator light, and then only if they aren't visable from the seat, is to try and get the backlight LED's working, and make do with just the backlight and the indicator, pull the other led's back and tape over them... it would satisfy legally... I'm just curious as to any alternatives people have going on.

So yeah... sorry for the essay...it's been a rough few weeks :bang: :ShitGrin:

All help appreciated! :cheers:

User avatar
sgtcall
LICENSE SUSPENDED!
Posts: 2797
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2016 5:59 pm
My Bike: Triumph Bonneville Speedmaster
Location: Stranded in New Jersey

Re: Help needed (pretty please)

Post by sgtcall »

Welcome!
Here are a couple of things to check out.

INTRUDER MANUALS AND INFORMATION
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=14168

POSTING PICTURES ON INTRUDERS ALERT
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=13992


And lets hope the experts start coming in.
Lechy wrote:
Wed Apr 05, 2023 11:08 pm
navigator wrote:
Mon Apr 03, 2023 8:45 am
hillsy v2 wrote:
Mon Apr 03, 2023 2:21 pm
Designer wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2023 8:17 pm
Herb wrote:
Tue Apr 04, 2023 5:01 pm
If you have any type of electrical issue, have your battery load tested before you do anything else. Any auto parts store will test it for free.

User avatar
hillsy v2
Bike out of hock
Posts: 3037
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2022 5:35 pm
My Bike: Too many to list

Re: Help needed (pretty please)

Post by hillsy v2 »

eBay can be fun...or not.


For the fuel pump stick with the 2 wire. The relay is only there to stop the pump if it runs without any pressure to shut it down. As long as it's on switchable power (kill switch) it's fine. Sounds like you need a new one though.

Gauges? I've used Acewell ones in the past and they were good (not even sure you can still get them?).


Water temp sensor? Nav or Lechy can probably help there.

SuzukiRock
Tricycles are Cool
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Oct 07, 2023 5:51 am
My Bike: Suzuki VS 750

Re: Help needed (pretty please)

Post by SuzukiRock »

Cheers for the input Hillsy,

Yeah the old pump was on it's last legs, but it was running on this pump before, just sounded like crap until it was running. It'll probably run again without a relay if I put a bigger fuse in, maybe it just blew because I'd hooked up an aux tank for doing the carbs and it was only just receiving fuel. I think for peace of mind I may just go with the Facet pump and wire that up without a relay, see how it goes, maybe try a 15A fuse and hope for the best.

As far as the guages go, the Acewell ones look nice, do a good range too. May stick a pin in them and just tape over the old idiot lights for the MOT, finish everything else and then look at upgrading to a set of those in the new year.

Seems to be so hard to find a middle ground with parts, everything is either bargain bin and broken on arrival or high end. Even sites like wemoto and M&P are selling the cheap junk at a markup.

Lechy
Joined a 1000cc Club
Posts: 3967
Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2014 9:58 pm
My Bike: VS800 Honda Phantom 200

Re: Help needed (pretty please)

Post by Lechy »

Looks like you have a real project on your hands.
The water temp controller is part of the OEM speedo, so if you have a different speedo, it's long gone. I fitted an after market speedo/tach on mine also a water temp gauge, living in Thailand the ambient temp is pretty high most of the year so I have the fan hooked up to the ignition so it is working all the time, it uses an induction motor so there are no brushes to worry about, like a computer fan. Never, ever fit a Chinese made fuel pump they only last a fortnight. I got hold of a suitable pump locally for about 25 quid, it's for a Mitsu or Nissan, made in Japan, had to cut off the mounting ears but it fits and works well, having a pump relay is more trouble than it's worth as the pump only works when the engine is cranking or running, no way to prime (it's a belt and braces safety feature).
Image

LED flashers require an LED compatible flasher unit and the indicator needs an LED bulb. Don't mix them, either all 4 LED's or incandescent.
The fun has just begun, carb synch and valve lash adjustment will greatly expand your cussword vocabulary.
To save yourself a whole lot of tail chasing, it would be advisable to make up and fit a new battery ground cable.
Grow old disgracefully young man.

TokyoManjiGang
Tricycles are Cool
Posts: 1
Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2023 6:26 pm
My Bike: 1986 VS700GLF

Re: Help needed (pretty please)

Post by TokyoManjiGang »

Dude I am in the same boat as you, I have an 87 VS700 half done bike from a buddy that gave up on and now I’m trying to get the wiring all situated and having the same problem as you 😞

Post Reply