It's Ramond's fault...

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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by RoadKing »

Prodigal_Sun wrote:
RoadKing wrote:
Prodigal_Sun wrote:
old time rider wrote:How can a theory be anything but a guess ? With RK on this.Just the word before any thing means just that! Your guess :putput: :putput:
Maybe in layman's terms. In the scientific community it means something else. What most people refer to as a "theory" would better be described as a hypothesis. Or 'hypothetical" it's an untested idea. Once it's gone through the Scientific Method it can become a Theory, as long as it obeys all the scientific laws ie. the law of gravity, it has been published in a scientific journal and subjected to peer review. Peer review is where all the scientists in the world try and poke holes in the hypothesis and disprove it somehow, if no one can, THEN it becomes a Theory.
OK... hog wash. Laymen? Really? My theory is right but yours is wrong? Even a layman can see through that. Scientific law alone is sacrosanct, the result of incontrovertible empirical evidence AND NOT THE RESULT OF A CONSENSUS OF SO CALLED SCIENTISTS. Laymen? Kiss my arse, brainiac. Theory is the same for a layman such as myself as it is to an elitist science guy such as yourself.
I'm just gonna leave this right here.

"The definition of a scientific theory (often contracted to "theory" for the sake of brevity) as used in the disciplines of science is significantly different from the common vernacular usage of the word "theory".[4][Note 1] In everyday speech, "theory" can imply that something is an unsubstantiated and speculative guess,[4] the opposite of its meaning in science."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_theory

You're doin' great though! [emoji106] Keep talking! :fu:

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:lolfall: What a maroon! You had to do a search then provide a link to prove you know something! :lolfall: I knew the difference between the two usages without all your wasted effort. Tell ya what... you are trying to give scientific theory the same weight as scientific law and that don’t cut it.
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by jeffcoslacker »

Prodigal_Sun wrote: I'm aware of that concept. All that does is reaffirm the possibility of "God" or whatever name you want to use for a consciousness that's higher, and greater than our own.
Not at all. To me it indicates that our existence and universe is just a sliver of what is probably an infinite and ultimately unknowable progression of such planes that interact in ways that are wonderful but baffling, given the physical laws of each individually.

The problem, as I see it, is that as humans our minds demand absolutes and values and borders. And if we are denied it, we invent them.

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Re: It's Raymond's fault...

Post by JFL Live »

jeffcoslacker wrote:
JFL Live wrote:
Cuban wrote: There may have been a big event that kicked off our observable universe, but I can't accept that all of everything started with an infinitely small singularity. Gotta be more to it than that... imo.
You are making the mistake of applying simple concepts of volume and energy and time to a condition where all of that would be completely meaningless.

Just like once you pass the event horizon of a black hole, all bets are off. You can no longer use any kind of mathematics or physics or time to describe it. It is a condition that cannot exist in "normal" space or reality.

As such, they may represent the only way this flatlander universe ever makes physical contact with the interior volume of the cube, so to speak.

Aside from in its beginning, I mean.

No, that's pretty much what I meant. I just don't have your way with words.
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by Prodigal_Sun »

RoadKing wrote:
Prodigal_Sun wrote:
RoadKing wrote:
Prodigal_Sun wrote:
old time rider wrote:How can a theory be anything but a guess ? With RK on this.Just the word before any thing means just that! Your guess :putput: :putput:
Maybe in layman's terms. In the scientific community it means something else. What most people refer to as a "theory" would better be described as a hypothesis. Or 'hypothetical" it's an untested idea. Once it's gone through the Scientific Method it can become a Theory, as long as it obeys all the scientific laws ie. the law of gravity, it has been published in a scientific journal and subjected to peer review. Peer review is where all the scientists in the world try and poke holes in the hypothesis and disprove it somehow, if no one can, THEN it becomes a Theory.
OK... hog wash. Laymen? Really? My theory is right but yours is wrong? Even a layman can see through that. Scientific law alone is sacrosanct, the result of incontrovertible empirical evidence AND NOT THE RESULT OF A CONSENSUS OF SO CALLED SCIENTISTS. Laymen? Kiss my arse, brainiac. Theory is the same for a layman such as myself as it is to an elitist science guy such as yourself.
I'm just gonna leave this right here.

"The definition of a scientific theory (often contracted to "theory" for the sake of brevity) as used in the disciplines of science is significantly different from the common vernacular usage of the word "theory".[4][Note 1] In everyday speech, "theory" can imply that something is an unsubstantiated and speculative guess,[4] the opposite of its meaning in science."

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientific_theory

You're doin' great though! [emoji106] Keep talking! :fu:

:cheers:
:lolfall: What a maroon! You had to do a search then provide a link to prove you know something! :lolfall: I knew the difference between the two usages without all your wasted effort. Tell ya what... you are trying to give scientific theory the same weight as scientific law and that don’t cut it.
I’m doin great? Yeah, I’m doing OK. Better than your dumb ass. :lmao:
Alright alright :lol: it's been 25 years since I learned all that. I got theories and laws backwards. I can admit when I'm wrong.

BUT it still means more than some stab in the dark, and it ain't "just a guess"

Until it can be disproved it might as well be law.
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by Prodigal_Sun »

"Theories are supported by evidence from many different sources, and may contain one or several laws."

Theories are made up of laws, not guesses.
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by RoadKing »

jeffcoslacker wrote:
Prodigal_Sun wrote: I'm aware of that concept. All that does is reaffirm the possibility of "God" or whatever name you want to use for a consciousness that's higher, and greater than our own.
Not at all. To me it indicates that our existence and universe is just a sliver of what is probably an infinite and ultimately unknowable progression of such planes that interact in ways that are wonderful but baffling, given the physical laws of each individually.

The problem, as I see it, is that as humans our minds demand absolutes and values and borders. And if we are denied it, we invent them.
God is infinite, Jeffco. I didn’t invent Him. He is The Creator. You look and see “an infinite and ultimately unknowable progression of planes”? Why do you think that is? The Creator is infinite. What you see out there at night is just a pretty picture that God gave you to wonder. As for me, I have theories on how to train dogs. But when it comes to The Infinite I leave theory alone and rest my belief on faith. God The Creator.
“Life’s but a walking shadow, a poor player, that struts and frets his hour upon the stage, and then is heard no more.
It is a tale told by an idiot, full of sound and fury…
Signifying nothing”

Signifying monkey, stay up in your tree. Always lying and signifying, but you better not monkey with me.

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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by Prodigal_Sun »

So you knew theories were compromised of laws, but you went off on a tangent calling them no more than guesses? Makes you a bit of a troll or a moron doesn't it?

I only remember it because it was one ofy professors biggest pet peeves.
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by Prodigal_Sun »

RoadKing wrote:
jeffcoslacker wrote:
Prodigal_Sun wrote: I'm aware of that concept. All that does is reaffirm the possibility of "God" or whatever name you want to use for a consciousness that's higher, and greater than our own.
Not at all. To me it indicates that our existence and universe is just a sliver of what is probably an infinite and ultimately unknowable progression of such planes that interact in ways that are wonderful but baffling, given the physical laws of each individually.

The problem, as I see it, is that as humans our minds demand absolutes and values and borders. And if we are denied it, we invent them.
God is infinite, Jeffco. I didn’t invent Him. He is The Creator. You look and see “an infinite and ultimately unknowable progression of planes”? Why do you think that is? The Creator is infinite. What you see out there at night is just a pretty picture that God gave you to wonder. As for me, I have theories on how to train dogs. But when it comes to The Infinite I leave theory alone and rest my belief on faith. God The Creator.
I'll agree with you on this. Faith is just as much of an abstract as infinity. It fills the gaps in what you can't know or understand.
:evil: [emoji56]

I have a lot of opinions, some of them professional, some of them educated, most of them I just pulled out of my @$$

Some of my best stupidity is largely self-inflicted. :roll:
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by jonnycando »

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

For by it the elders obtained a good report.

Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

By faith Abel offered unto God a more excellent sacrifice than Cain, by which he obtained witness that he was righteous, God testifying of his gifts: and by it he being dead yet speaketh.

By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God.

But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith.

By faith Abraham, when he was called to go out into a place which he should after receive for an inheritance, obeyed; and he went out, not knowing whither he went.

By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise:

For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.

Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of a child when she was past age, because she judged him faithful who had promised.

Therefore sprang there even of one, and him as good as dead, so many as the stars of the sky in multitude, and as the sand which is by the sea shore innumerable.

These all died in faith, not having received the promises, but having seen them afar off, and were persuaded of them, and embraced them, and confessed that they were strangers and pilgrims on the earth.

For they that say such things declare plainly that they seek a country.

And truly, if they had been mindful of that country from whence they came out, they might have had opportunity to have returned.

But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.

By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son,

Of whom it was said, That in Isaac shall thy seed be called:

Accounting that God was able to raise him up, even from the dead; from whence also he received him in a figure.

By faith Isaac blessed Jacob and Esau concerning things to come.

By faith Jacob, when he was a dying, blessed both the sons of Joseph; and worshipped, leaning upon the top of his staff.

By faith Joseph, when he died, made mention of the departing of the children of Israel; and gave commandment concerning his bones.

By faith Moses, when he was born, was hid three months of his parents, because they saw he was a proper child; and they were not afraid of the king's commandment.

By faith Moses, when he was come to years, refused to be called the son of Pharaoh's daughter;

Choosing rather to suffer affliction with the people of God, than to enjoy the pleasures of sin for a season;

Esteeming the reproach of Christ greater riches than the treasures in Egypt: for he had respect unto the recompence of the reward.

By faith he forsook Egypt, not fearing the wrath of the king: for he endured, as seeing him who is invisible.

Through faith he kept the passover, and the sprinkling of blood, lest he that destroyed the firstborn should touch them.

By faith they passed through the Red sea as by dry land: which the Egyptians assaying to do were drowned.

By faith the walls of Jericho fell down, after they were compassed about seven days.

By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.

And what shall I more say? for the time would fail me to tell of Gedeon, and of Barak, and of Samson, and of Jephthae; of David also, and Samuel, and of the prophets:

Who through faith subdued kingdoms, wrought righteousness, obtained promises, stopped the mouths of lions.

Quenched the violence of fire, escaped the edge of the sword, out of weakness were made strong, waxed valiant in fight, turned to flight the armies of the aliens.

Women received their dead raised to life again: and others were tortured, not accepting deliverance; that they might obtain a better resurrection: And others had trial of cruel mockings and scourgings, yea, moreover of bonds and imprisonment:

37 They were stoned, they were sawn asunder, were tempted, were slain with the sword: they wandered about in sheepskins and goatskins; being destitute, afflicted, tormented: (Of whom the world was not worthy:) they wandered in deserts, and in mountains, and in dens and caves of the earth.

And these all, having obtained a good report through faith, received not the promise:

God having provided some better thing for us, that they without us should not be made perfect.

What we as Christians believe we may believe ONLY by faith, we cannot and must not seek physical evidence for even if it is proof, it will color our faith. Do not trouble us about our faith, it is not a stumbling block for you if we believe. And it benefits you none to pull us away from it. It takes nothing from you that we do believe.

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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by Suzuki Johnny »

Prodigal_Sun wrote:
old time rider wrote:How can a theory be anything but a guess ? With RK on this.Just the word before any thing means just that! Your guess :putput: :putput:
Maybe in layman's terms. In the scientific community it means something else. What most people refer to as a "theory" would better be described as a hypothesis. Or 'hypothetical" it's an untested idea. Once it's gone through the Scientific Method it can become a Theory, as long as it obeys all the scientific laws ie. the law of gravity, it has been published in a scientific journal and subjected to peer review. Peer review is where all the scientists in the world try and poke holes in the hypothesis and disprove it somehow, if no one can, THEN it becomes a Theory.


You're saying that an hypothesis to become a theory it must obey the laws of gravity....... :confused: [emoji2]
Did gravity exist before the big bang.....or was it created after the BB?
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by jeffcoslacker »

Suzuki Johnny wrote:
Did gravity exist before the big bang.....or was it created after the BB?

Unknowable, and yes.

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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by Prodigal_Sun »

Suzuki Johnny wrote:
Prodigal_Sun wrote:
old time rider wrote:How can a theory be anything but a guess ? With RK on this.Just the word before any thing means just that! Your guess :putput: :putput:
Maybe in layman's terms. In the scientific community it means something else. What most people refer to as a "theory" would better be described as a hypothesis. Or 'hypothetical" it's an untested idea. Once it's gone through the Scientific Method it can become a Theory, as long as it obeys all the scientific laws ie. the law of gravity, it has been published in a scientific journal and subjected to peer review. Peer review is where all the scientists in the world try and poke holes in the hypothesis and disprove it somehow, if no one can, THEN it becomes a Theory.


You're saying that an hypothesis to become a theory it must obey the laws of gravity....... :confused: [emoji2]
Did gravity exist before the big bang.....or was it created after the BB?
If I have a hypothesis that if I drop a ball it will hit the floor, then yes, it has to obey the law of gravity to become a theory. If I have a hypothesis that if I turn on a light in a dark room I'll be able to see, then no, it does not have to obey the law of gravity to become a theory.
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by old time rider »

Glad I am not as smart as you all cause then I mite give a dam! :lmao: :putput:

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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by Prodigal_Sun »

old time rider wrote:Glad I am not as smart as you all cause then I mite give a dam! :lmao: :putput:
[emoji106] Dumbest thing I ever did was believe that getting a degree meant I'd be able to get a better paying job. :bonk:
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by BlacktopTravelr »

Prodigal_Sun wrote: [emoji106] Dumbest thing I ever did was believe that getting a degree meant I'd be able to get a better paying job. :bonk:
You didn't believe hard enough or you would have gotten that better paying job. :soda: [space] :HatTip:
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by lonerider »

A new graduate has a much better chance at getting an entry level job in the career of his choice than a non-graduate.

Also, a college graduate will have an easier time separating the pseudo science BS in this thread from the real deal.

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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by Herb »

lonerider wrote:A new graduate has a much better chance at getting an entry level job in the career of his choice than a non-graduate.

Also, a college graduate will have an easier time separating the pseudo science BS in this thread from the real deal.
don't bet money on either one of those statements
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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by old time rider »

Yes have to go with the degree helps. All I have is high school and a few IBM things and a wind tunnel extra to learn operations. So not that educated but have some friends that sure did not do that well with higher learning. Still pay check to pay check at 70! My dad may be the one to thank for that. With only eight grades of school and a little GI training after WW II he raised five kids.Paid for three small farms and built three homes all most by him self.All so a natural wrench.Sure wish that last gene had came my way! :putput:

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Re: It's Ramond's fault...

Post by RoadKing »

A WHOLE lot of my friends have retired from the building trades with a good retirement and mortgage free... high school diploma only and in California! Harleys in the garage at night and lots of day time rides.

And then, there’s lots of sniveling college degree fools out there with unpaid student loans, got nothing, but think the world owes them something. I’m proud of my friends and the company i keep. Fun loving happy people! :cheers:
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Signifying nothing”

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