Revzilla's take on HD and Polaris low numbers

[DevilsFan]

Bullshit. I'd have posted an article on Honda or Suzuki just the same.

That's like saying your not racist "because I have a good friend who is is black...."

That's ridiculous. You say I'm the insecure one but you check any post where "Harley Davidson" is merely mentioned and you HD owners go completely off the rails! I will never understand why you all have a PERSONAL issue and feel so PERSONALLY threatened.
You can bash Honda and my little 700cc scooter all day long but you will NEVER see me go into personal attacks like you! Do you not see that, really???

[MadCow]

Bullshit. I'd have posted an article on Honda or Suzuki just the same.

That's like saying your not racist "because I have a good friend who is is black...."

That's ridiculous. You say I'm the insecure one but you check any post where "Harley Davidson" is merely mentioned and you HD owners go completely off the rails! I will never understand why you all have a PERSONAL issue and feel so PERSONALLY threatened.
You can bash Honda and my little 700cc scooter all day long but you will NEVER see me go into personal attacks like you! Do you not see that, really???

Oh no...not off the rails at all


I've never bashed your Honda, and really dude...you feel like I have personally attacked you?

[DevilsFan]

Bullshit. I'd have posted an article on Honda or Suzuki just the same.

That's like saying your not racist "because I have a good friend who is is black...."

That's ridiculous. You say I'm the insecure one but you check any post where "Harley Davidson" is merely mentioned and you HD owners go completely off the rails! I will never understand why you all have a PERSONAL issue and feel so PERSONALLY threatened.
You can bash Honda and my little 700cc scooter all day long but you will NEVER see me go into personal attacks like you! Do you not see that, really???

Oh no...not off the rails at all


I've never bashed your Honda, and really dude...you feel like I have personally attacked you?

Go re-read your posts!!! Do you not see how bent you HD owners get? There's a reason so many make fun of ya'll. It's hilarious in a sense and VERY predictable!


NEW THREAD

Me: "Harley Davidson is...."

HD Owners response: "What the hell are you trying to say?!?!? Harley's been around for years!!! I'd never own another bike again that isn't a Harley!!! What's your beef with Harley?!?!?! Why are you trolling Harley?!?!?! Always someone bashing Harley!!!

Me: ...I was about to say I like their new 2018's.

[DevilsFan]

(because I didn't want this post to be about HD bashing):

Uhm, no ....you're insecure, which is exactly why you posted this.

And you asked how you went after me personally?!

[MadCow]

(because I didn't want this post to be about HD bashing):

Uhm, no ....you're insecure, which is exactly why you posted this.

And you asked how you went after me personally?!

Maybe you're a bit insecure *AND* overly sensitive?

Here let me stir the pot a little;

ALL bikes have and always will be compared to a Harley-Davidson. That is a fact.

Now...you gotta ask...who sets the standards?

[DevilsFan]

(because I didn't want this post to be about HD bashing):

Uhm, no ....you're insecure, which is exactly why you posted this.

And you asked how you went after me personally?!

Maybe you're a bit insecure *AND* overly sensitive?

Here let me stir the pot a little;

ALL bikes have and always will be compared to a Harley-Davidson. That is a fact.

Now...you gotta ask...who sets the standards?

Dude, you have an answer for everything, only you start changing subjects without ever acknowledging.

Here's another fact...Honda has been whooping HD's ass in global sales for a really long time, and continues to do so! Another fact...Honda has a much better marketing plan. They don't need t-shirts and grilling utensils to sell their products.
Final observation...HD better get their shit together or things will get way worse for them.

Now THAT'S pot-stirring!

[MadCow]

(because I didn't want this post to be about HD bashing):

Uhm, no ....you're insecure, which is exactly why you posted this.

And you asked how you went after me personally?!

Maybe you're a bit insecure *AND* overly sensitive?

Here let me stir the pot a little;

ALL bikes have and always will be compared to a Harley-Davidson. That is a fact.

Now...you gotta ask...who sets the standards?

Dude, you have an answer for everything, only you start changing subjects without ever acknowledging.

Here's another fact...Honda has been whooping HD's ass in global sales for a really long time, and continues to do so! Another fact...Honda has a much better marketing plan. They don't need t-shirts and grilling utensils to sell their products.
Final observation...HD better get their shit together or things will get way worse for them.

Now THAT'S pot-stirring!

You're right, and I'll keep right on enjoying the hell out of my over priced paint shaker!

[hillsy]

ALL bikes have and always will be compared to a Harley-Davidson. That is a fact.

Now...you gotta ask...who sets the standards?

Maybe in heavy cruiser world, but in no way is this true as far as performance bikes go. Honda invented the modern superbike with the first CB750 and the rest of the industry who makes performance bikes has followed their lead.

The closest thing HD got to a performance bike was the Buell.

But that didn't end well....

[RoadKing]

DF, we ride. Motorcycles. All that matters. It’s an amazing thing we do on two wheels. You live in Florida, i would be out riding in your climate and to hell with all the keyboard jousting. I’d give anything to ride tonight but I’m surrounded by ice and snow. Now, you asked me a question about business and frankly I gave you a very educated answer if that is really what you wanted. I have never made fun of what you ride because I’m not really sure what you ride. You don’t mention it often. Maybe you should. Unabashedly and often is cool, it’s ok.

[DevilsFan]

DF, we ride. Motorcycles. All that matters. It’s an amazing thing we do on two wheels. You live in Florida, i would be out riding in your climate and to hell with all the keyboard jousting. I’d give anything to ride tonight but I’m surrounded by ice and snow. Now, you asked me a question about business and frankly I gave you a very educated answer if that is really what you wanted. I have never made fun of what you ride because I’m not really sure what you ride. You don’t mention it often. Maybe you should. Unabashedly and often is cool, it’s ok.

I gotcha ya! Like stated previously, I don't want to see HD fail. But I would question their business decisions now more than ever. I was also mad that I laid out what I was thinking and the stupid computer or site or internet connection blanked it out on me.

Madcow is the one that got more personal but, whatever.

[DevilsFan]

Back to the topic at hand...

Here's another article on HONDA this time.

Which begs to question...should HD take a look at what Honda's doing? If HD plans to throw out that LiveWire they'll be putting a lot on the line. Whereas Honda is starting small.

http://www.motorcycle.com/mini-features ... -html.html

One of their best-selling scooters, with a replaceable battery! Once the current one is depleted ya just throw in the charged one! I'm not thinking HD has this in mind for their LiveWire...but they should take note. LiveWire's capacity only takes the bike about 60-80 miles. That ain't gonna do it.

[MadCow]

ALL bikes have and always will be compared to a Harley-Davidson. That is a fact.

Now...you gotta ask...who sets the standards?

Maybe in heavy cruiser world, but in no way is this true as far as performance bikes go. Honda invented the modern superbike with the first CB750 and the rest of the industry who makes performance bikes has followed their lead.

The closest thing HD got to a performance bike was the Buell.

But that didn't end well....

Completely agree...even my 2009 VROD Muscle...as quick was it was, is just a power cruiser and not a performance bike...and is currently the fastest thing HD has...and my FJR1300 would run circles around it plus had panniers and a top case...different class of bike for sure..

I had a Ninja ZX11R back in the day...and at the time it was top dog...until the Hayabusa came out (I think that was in '96?) and it was dethroned.

When I think of performance I think of Yamaha R1, Hayabusa, CBR1000RR etc etc...HD never comes to mind. These latter bikes are truely performance racing bikes..and have my respect...

I'm even iffy about putting the 'Busa in the list of performance bikes since the others handle more like racing bikes..the Hayabusa can't hang in the twisties like a true racing bike...of course handling being relative to their class...'Busas just don't have the granularity...they're more brute power....kings of the drag strip.

[MadCow]

Back to the topic at hand...

Here's another article on HONDA this time.

Which begs to question...should HD take a look at what Honda's doing? If HD plans to throw out that LiveWire they'll be putting a lot on the line. Whereas Honda is starting small.

http://www.motorcycle.com/mini-features ... -html.html

One of their best-selling scooters, with a replaceable battery! Once the current one is depleted ya just throw in the charged one! I'm not thinking HD has this in mind for their LiveWire...but they should take note. LiveWire's capacity only takes the bike about 60-80 miles. That ain't gonna do it.

If they had something that could go 150 miles maybe...but then again...how to "refill" the charge quickly for the return trip? My commute into DC (when I'm not fying off somewhere) round trip is 93 miles...and sometimes I get stuck in traffic for 2.5 hours on the return trip home...

This might work for someone living INSIDE the big city...not for a commuter though...which most people are...I think they should be very careful and think of all the true driving variables out there.

Bikes need to be made for how people plan to use them...they should NOT be dictating how the the buyer will have to use it...if that makes any sense.

[RoadKing]

Performance. How something performs under different conditions. Yes? As a Harley rider I am aware that my bike does not perform on the race track or in the dirt. But it performs very well on the highway. Apples and oranges and grapes and they all are great. I will never race nor ride in the dirt but I’m cool with those that do.

Makes me laugh thinking about the future, all the metric electric bat bike riders trashing the Harley bat bikes. Sorry, that thought just tickled my funny bone.

[jeffcoslacker]

I noticed back in 2009-10 or so that while new car sales went essentially stagnant after C4C died down, they were selling certified pre-owned as fast as they could drive them onto the lot from auction.

I said at some point that they needed to figure out how to build brand new used cars, since that's what people want and the margins are higher for the dealers.

Those CPO's are almost universally lease returns, and I'm pretty sure those short term (1-2 year) leases are what kept them afloat for that period. Sold new units and provided lots of CPO fodder to keep the dealers busy.

Does anyone lease a motorcycle? I have heard of Harley leasing to police departments but only by way of a salesman and I don't know if he knew what he was talking about.

[RoadKing]

Brand new used cars! Huh?

[navigator]

Speaking of ice and snow, My POLARIS snow machine will kick the ass out of any motorsickle out there.
I'm gonna take my POLARIS for a romp right now up here in the icey snowy north east.

[RoadKing]

Speaking of ice and snow, My POLARIS snow machine will kick the ass out of any motorsickle out there.
I'm gonna take my POLARIS for a romp right now up here in the icey snowy north east.

I mostly hobble around with my walking stick out back trying to keep from getting knocked over into a snow bank by my playful pups. Never rode a snow machine, they scare me.

[jeffcoslacker]

Brand new used cars! Huh?

That is essentially what they ended up doing, they flooded the fleet markets with cheap short term leases so they could sell them after a year as CPOs and make more on them than if they just sold outright. We took tons of manufacturer lease turnbacks to auction that were a year or two old and not even showing 5 digits on the odometer yet. Those sell really nicely. Looks, runs, drives, smells new, still warrantied, 2/3 cost of new, what's not to like?

[Tbeck]

MC, hard to beat the RGU for touring, but I sure wish that they'd put the air assist forks back on. My 99 RG made RGU was likely the best touring bike I have ever owned. The 2007 and 2010, and 2014 all fell way short and I am 100% sure it was the lack of adjustability of the forks that made the difference.
Like you I could drop the $$$ if I was inclined to do so, and I have many times. I am liking the C14 even if my right knee is done by the end of the day. Probably just toss on some hwy peg's so I can stretch occasionally on long runs. It's no BMW or HD but loads of fun.
I think that ALL the MC manufacturers are going to see a slump. It's been profiting off the fad for about 10 year's, but the fad is fading. The manufacturer's are gonna have to settle for us ole die hards