Air in clutch line?

[LSU Tiger]

I had total ankle surgery december 7 and today i started to ride my 2000 vs 800 (76K). When I put the bike in gear it went dead, just like it did before when i had air in the lines. i checked the reservoir and it was full, not even close to the hole in the bottom. could i have air in the line if it did not get in thru the reservoir? Or is something else possible since it has been sitting up for 75 days. I cranked it and let it get hot every three days during the time i did not ride it but i did not work the clutch. i had new clutch plates and springs installed at 55k which was about 6 years ago.thanks. joey broome

[navigator]

You say..."When I put the bike in gear it went dead,"
Do you mean the engine shut off when you placed it in gear?
If you had air in the system and the motor was running, the bike would want to creep forward as if the clutch lever was not pulled in.
If the engine immediately dies when you put it in gear, either your kickstand is down or the kickstand switch is thinking it is down.

[hillsy]

You say..."When I put the bike in gear it went dead,"
Do you mean the engine shut off when you placed it in gear?
If you had air in the system and the motor was running, the bike would want to creep forward as if the clutch lever was not pulled in.
If the engine immediately dies when you put it in gear, either your kickstand is down or the kickstand switch is thinking it is down.

Yeah - more likely the switch than the clutch.

Does it try to jump forward / stall or just shut off? If it just shuts off more than likely the switch.

[LSU Tiger]

It lunges forward.

[navigator]

If it lunges forward, it's time to bleed the clutch.
And yes, the slave can leak fluid and bring in air, even though the MC remains full.

[Designer]

Along the lines of what Navigator mentions, have you recently Topped Off the Fluid Level in the Master Cylinder ...or some fluid under the Engine near the Slave Cylinder?

Here's some helpful types on Bleeding The System:

http://intruders-alert.com/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=4

[hillsy]

Reverse bleeding with a syringe works well too. Especially on clutches where you can't get the pressure like you can on brakes.

[navigator]

Reverse bleeding with a syringe works well too. Especially on clutches where you can't get the pressure like you can on brakes.

Yup!! it also purges air from high spots along the line.

[Designer]

Yes,...the rising Hydraulic Fluid drives upward any air.

However, I have found that said-same Rising Fluid drives air ( which by gravity wants to up anyways) into the tiny space between the Outside of the Master Cylinder's Banjo Bolt (and it's inlet hole) and the Curvilinear Inside Surface/Shape of the Brake Lines' Banjo Fitting.

This becomes an issue especially if one does not pay attention to the relationship of the level between the aforementioned Air-trapped in the Banjo Bolt Space and the Fluid Outlet Holes in the bottom of the Master Cylinder.

Specifically, if the Master Cylinder Holes are below the level of the Air trapped at the Banjo Bolt/Banjo Fitting,...you will still have air in the system. Doesn't matter what Bleeding method was used.

And enough so, that when I have removed such Trapped Air for many of my fellow Intruder Riders, (800/1400/1500) they cannot help but remark at the Improved Clutch Action/Feel.

If needed, I can draw a Sectional Drawing of the Banjo Bolt/Banjo Fitting Air-Trap to help illustrate that of which I speak.

[navigator]

Yup!! cracking the banjo bolt loose under pressure purges that as well.

[Designer]

That action does help,...but I have found it is not always as complete a Air-remover as one thinks.

And,...it makes for the possibility of Drips/Splatter/Spray-Mist of Hydraulic Fluid on Paint,...ones that can often go undetected,...which is a known Paint Remover.

But,...One can do as they please!

I'm here to give everyone the benefit of my experiences,..... so they need not repeat my mistakes that I learned from.

[LSU Tiger]

We reverse bled and top bled the brakes today. I do not believe there is air in the line. It still lurches forward when I put it in gear. Remember, it sat up (except for cranking every three days) for 75 days. Any suggestions? Thanks.

[Designer]

Now this sounds kind of like stuck Plates.

Without the engine running, try putting it in First Gear and rocking it back-and-forth,...clutch in-and-out a few times maybe even having some guys help push it to add to the forces.

[LSU Tiger]

We put the bike in first (and later 4th) gear and rocked/scooted the bike about 12 feet twice. Clutch was pulled in and released between pushes. No change. Still no clutch. Thanks.

[Designer]

Hmmm. This is a tough one!

May I ask, when did you perform this Pushing the bike 12 feet? Was it before or after your recent reverse Bleed?

Also, how does the clutch lever "Feel"? Does it have the same resistance-to-pulling it in as normal?

[LSU Tiger]

The pushing was after both bleeds. I do not remember exactly how much resistance clutch is supposed to have. It does have some resistance.

[Designer]

The pushing was after both bleeds. I do not remember exactly how much resistance clutch is supposed to have. It does have some resistance.

Okay! Now,...before you did the engine-off-pushing-it-in-Gear I suggested, you obviously pulled in the Lever and shifted it into Gear.

How hard was it to get into First Gear from Neutral? And also, when you went from 1st Gear into 4th Gear, how hard was the shifting? ( the lever was pulled in, right?)

[LSU Tiger]

Yes, the lever was pulled in when I was shifting gears. It shifts rather easily. Thanks.

[LSU Tiger]

If it is the clutch plates sticking would it help to crank the bike and let it get real hot?

[Designer]

Yes, the lever was pulled in when I was shifting gears. It shifts rather easily. Thanks.

I have found that the best way to solve puzzling problems is to take one thing at a time. Since I am not there to check things out, and you report that the Gear Shifts were easy when the Clutch Lever was pulled in, at this point,.....help me out with doing this with the Key Off.

1. Sit on the Bike, put it Neutral and see how easily it rolls,...if there is resistance, does the Engine try to Turn Over? If not,...next thing.

2. Sit on the Bike, put it in First Gear, leave the Clutch Lever out and see what resistance you get. If alot of resistance, does the Engine try to Turn Over? If so,...next thing.

3. Now, as you are pushing forwards in First Gear, (and the Engine is trying to Turn Over), pull the Clutch Lever in. Does the Bike move easier & without the Engine Turning Over? ( of course It should, if all is normal )

4. If so, keep the Cutch Lever pulled in, keep pushing forwards and see if it gets harder to move and the Engine begins to try to Turn Over as time goes by.