Front Cylinder, slight Head chatter/clatter, Help diagnosing?

[94szki]

Hello all!

I have a good ear and I hear some slight valve tap (or some type of upper cylinder clatter) from the forward most cylinder (nearest the front wheel). I can't hear this on the rear cylinder.

There could very likely be nothing wrong with the engine - it could just be my paranoia.

I really would hate to kill a nice engine that only has 13k on the clock. What are some things that I can do to make sure that the engine is running as it should?

How it sits:

1. Approximately 13k miles
2. Running Mobile 1 synthetic motorcycle race oil. (It has oil, verified through the inspection window)
3. Running 93 octane

Things I need to do:

1. Change oil (already purchased same Mobile 1 race oil and new filter)
2. Change to 87 octane at next empty tank
3. Change out final drive gear oil (i know it's not related to the head clatter, anyone know what gear oil to use?)
4. Flush radiator Fluid (who knows how old it is)
5. Replace spark plugs (already have them), try to identify how rich or lean the bike is running (I am running straight oem mufflers - no baffles)

Things I want to learn how to do:

1. Compression Test on both Cylinders (Is there a fuse for the fuel pump? How do i do this?)
2. Gumout or seafoam treatment? (I've used a few full bottles of gumout fuel additive before, but I haven't put seafoam in the crank. Too scared to touch the crank)
3. Use an inspection camera to peak inside the spark plug hole to look at the pistons?
4. Clean carbs, inspect carbs (I know nothing about carbs, and the front one has a bit of grime around some of the screws on the left side.)
5. Carb sync?
6. Replace to 2 points larger main jets since I removed all baffles from exhaust?

Any ideas? Again it could very well be absolutely nothing, but I'm a bit paranoid and I want the engine to be running silky SMOOTH.

Can i put some Lucas motorcycle additive into the crank along with the next oil change? This may potentially help keep all the delicate internals lubricated right?

[WintrSol]

The engine has tappets, so will have some valve clatter (a tappy valve is a happy valve [emoji2] )
The tappet covers come off fairly easily, once you have the fuel tank off, and you can set the tappets to the correct gap (.003" to .005"); that will minimize the banging around, but there will always be some.

[navigator]

As WinterSol stated, slight valve clatter is normal, and should be present.
Setting the valves is an involved process and should be done when the engine is cold....003" to .005" clearance at the lobe base circle.
There are markings on the flywheel visible when the front plug is removed on the left engine cover. FronT cylinder is done on the FT mark. ReaR on the RT mark.
13K is a young engine.
Use 80w90 hypoid gear lube for the rear gear oil, it takes approx. 8 oz. to fill it. Clean the magnet on the drain plug, and fill to the bottom of the fill hole with the bike vertical.
Radiator is 50/50 mix of glycol antifreeze with one ounce of liquid Barsleak to lubricate the fuel pump. Drain the fluid on the left frame rail behind the muffler. Crack loose the bleeder bolt on the left frame rail near the neck cover when filling to purge any air.
Carb sync is also an involved process, but done properly, the bike will run super smooth.
I would not put any additive in the oil since the engine and tranny use the same oil. A wet clutch may be adversely affected by additives.
External carb dirt will not affect the engine. Put 3 ounces of Seafoam in a full tank of 87 to clean the carb internals. Do that twice a year and you should be fine.
Rejetting should not be required if you are getting approx. 50 mpg.

All of the above is JMO.

[WintrSol]

All this, plus some drawings and photos, are in the Service Manual, available in the locked thread near the top of this section. You should download a copy, and look through the various sections that cover your areas of interest, it could save $$.

[Lechy]

No need to re-jet after removing baffles, just an adjustment to the slow running (AF) both carbs and maybe a carb synch. A couple of videos here, read through the whole post:
http://intruders-alert.com/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=4139

Sometimes vibration can be miss-diagnosed as valve clatter, most common culprits are the filler cap and headlamp bezel. A loose spark plug bypassing can sound similar as could a leaking header gasket.
Following is a procedure for valve lash check, to make the valve cover removal from the front cylinder rear valve cover easier it helps to loosen the carb clamp and push the carb back a little.

Not my write up but kudos to the anonymous contributer.

Do not attempt this procedure unless you are mechanically inclined. Valve adjustment has always been one of my pet peeves. I love to have them well adjusted, hate to adjust.I figured this procedure out when my friend sold my other friend his 800 and I gave the bike a complete service. I thank Bill Akins who, although never having done the procedure himself, was kind enough to check his manual and e-mail me the necessary technical information to carry it out.

Background:

If valve clearances are too tight, the valves can be seriously damaged by warping or burning and compression will eventually suffer from lack of proper valve seating. Valves are cooled by resting against the valve seat if they're open too long, they have insufficient time to rest against their seats and transfer their heat to the cylinder head. On the other hand, if the clearance is too loose, the result will be rough running, loss of power, and excessive wear of the valve train components. Therefore, if you must choose, remember that a little looser is better than tighter.

Before you adjust the valves the engine must be dead cold. In other words, the engine must have been left to cool overnight. The cold clearance is .003 .005 of an inch on all valves. I ended up setting them at .004 all around. However, if you have a bike that tends to overheat, you can set the exhaust to .005 You can also do the opposite, set your intake valves to .005 for better breathing.

Procedure:

If you have a stand or lift, raise the bike; if not, place a 2X4 block of wood under the side stand to prop it up, but make absolutely sure it is firm to avoid having it fall down.

Remove seats and gas tank.

Remove the front cylinder right hand chrome head cover and take the spark plug out (or just loosen). Remove the rear cylinder left hand chrome head cover and also take the spark plug out (this makes it easier to turn the engine over by hand ). You will be working on the front cylinder valves from the right side of the bike and working on the rear cylinder valves from the left side of the bike.

On the top front and top rear of each cylinder head are the valve covers (four in total). Remove them ([six] 8 mm & [two]10 mm nuts). Make sure you note exactly where and how each cover is placed since they have a thick and thin side. It's a cumbersome process and you will have to loosen the wiring straps (and other stuff) and move around the wiring harness (and other stuff) that runs along the top of the frame to get better access. If your fingers are not so nimble you might have to take out the front carb. The valve covers have rubber O-rings which must be cleaned before reinstall (if the O-rings are flattened or in bad condition, buy new ones). Also, clean the valve covers well and make sure you place the O-ring back in correctly, since it fits in a certain manner. Coat the O-rings with a little oil before reinstall.

On the left engine case cover is a large slotted plug, remove; be very careful since the plug is chrome and sometimes very tight, therefore you can mess it up real easy. This plug has a rubber O-ring which you must cleaned (replace if damaged); smear a little oil before reinstalling. Under that plug is a nut (17 mm) you use to turn the engine crankshaft counter-clockwise. Just in front of this large plug is a smaller plug on the front side of the left engine cover. Remove the smaller plug with an Allen wrench. This is the sight glass used to align your valve timing marks. There is an alignment arrow (a triangle) stamped on the case on the left side of the sight glass looking at it from the front.

Turn the crankshaft counter-clockwise (if you look carefully, the direction arrow is stamped on the flywheel) {also, I turn the engine over a couple of times to take up any slack} until you see on the flywheel (very close to each other) one F/F and one F/T mark (meaning that the front cylinder piston is at top dead center and its exhaust and intake valves are either fully closed or open ). If you keep turning you will reach the R/F and R/T marks (meaning that the rear cylinder piston is at top dead center and its exhaust and intake valves are either fully closed or open). If for some reason you go past the marks, do not turn back, just keep on turning counter-clockwise until you reach them again. Remember that you might have to go several turns because what you are trying to achieve is place the piston at TDC with the valves in the fully closed position, ie: "relaxed". The F/F and R/F marks are for ignition timing (yes, although the ignition is digital, it is timed at the factory). The F/T and R/T marks are for adjusting the valves. Adjust valves at these marks. You will work on the front cylinder first, so get to the F/T mark first. Once the F/T mark is in the center of the sight glass and aligned with the alignment arrow, you must check to see if there is free play at both the intake (on the rear part of the cylinder) and exhaust (on the front part of the cylinder) valve rocker arms by jiggling them up and down. The movement is slight. If not, rotate the crankshaft 360 degrees (counter-clockwise) and check again until the valves reach what I call the "relaxed" position.

Loosen the valve adjuster lock nut (10 mm). It is tight, so be careful not to scrape your knuckles. After the lock nut is loose, hold it with a wrench and work the adjusting bolt back and forth to get the threads in a little easier adjusting shape. You need a special adjuster wrench since the top of the adjuster nut is square. I used needle nose pliers because that's all I had at the time, but buy the wrench.



Insert a feeler gauge between the exhaust valve rocker arm adjuster bolt and the end of the valve. The fit is really tight and you've got to struggle, bend and move the feeler to get it right. Turn the adjuster until you feel a slight drag on the feeler gauge when it is inserted and withdrawn. Close your eyes and feel the slide of the feeler blade to become acquainted with the sensation. If you have a friend who knows how to work a feeler gauge ask him to check it. You should hear and feel a particular rubbing sound as the feeler slides between the metal surfaces. Once you've got it, press the opposite end of the rocker (opposite to where the feeler is) to make sure it's down and you are not getting a false reading (you can also lift the rocker for the same effect). If everything is OK, carefully place a wrench on the adjuster lock nut and on top of that wrench place the special adjuster bolt wrench and tighten the lock nut while holding the adjuster bolt to keep it from moving. Tighten partially, recheck the clearance and if it's right, tighten the lock nut all the way. Recheck clearance. Repeat for the remaining exhaust valve and do the same for the intake valves. (800's have four valves per cylinder).

Now turn the crankshaft counter-clockwise until you reach the R/T mark and repeat the above for the rear cylinder. Make sure you do not go past the mark as the turn will be about 285 degrees. Make sure the valves are in the "relaxed" position.

The biggest hassle when adjusting is being able to slide that straight feeler gauge into a most restricted space, but curving the blade and a few McGyver style moves should do it. If you have never adjusted valves get ready to spend a good while, some cussin' and adjusting several times 'till you get it down pat. Once you have some practice it's faster and easier.

Install the valve, timing and crankshaft covers. Organize your wiring, straps and "other stuff"; Remember to tighten the spark plugs! Replace the cylinder head chrome covers, tank and seats.
Finally, because you moved the throttle cables around a carb synch will be a good idea.

Regards,

CR

Good luck.
[emoji41]

[Herb]

On top of everything else make sure you don't have an exhaust leak where the pipe attached to the head. A small leak there can sound like a tapping noise.